How about a small scale shredder for metal?

I keep telling my guys to cut down, clean up non-ferrous as they go along, but nobody listens.
I have a big pile of copper lines, mostly from dishwashers and they take up a crapload of space.
I crimp and bend them into 6-8 inch pieces so much more weight fits into the buckets.
But it is tideous boring A.F. work.
So I was thinking, is there a small scale metal shredder that would shred my #2 copper lines into smaller chunks?
I would be willing to pay a few 100 bucks for it since it would save so much time in the long run.
TIA
Martin

I would talk to your buyer before shredding anything. it may affect the pricing or your ability to sell. shredding makes it more difficult to look for items that don't belong

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Originally Posted by aph

I keep telling my guys to cut down, clean up non-ferrous as they go along, but nobody listens.
I have a big pile of copper lines, mostly from dishwashers and they take up a crapload of space.
I crimp and bend them into 6-8 inch pieces so much more weight fits into the buckets.
But it is tideous boring A.F. work.
So I was thinking, is there a small scale metal shredder that would shred my #2 copper lines into smaller chunks?
I would be willing to pay a few 100 bucks for it since it would save so much time in the long run.
TIA
Martin

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When you say you keep telling your guys, I'm assuming they work for you and they are not doing their job the way you told them to. If that's the case you have a few options.

1. Hey guys, I just bought a machine to cut the copper lines and I'm cutting your pay to help pay for it.

2. Hey guys, this is how I want you to do your job. If you can't do it the way I told you to, then get in you effing trucks and go home.

I would not make a good manager.

jimicrk I like and respect you more each day!! :cool:

you could build one just a couple of truck rear end gears and anelectric motor or buy a hard drive shredder.

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Originally Posted by EcoSafe

you could build one just a couple of truck rear end gears and anelectric motor or buy a hard drive shredder.

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A small Ameri-Shred HDD shredder will run you about $15000.

For those pipes, I think a baler would work better.

I think a cheaper alternative would be a bandsaw.

One of the yards I go to has something with jaws that look like a huge pair of bolt cutters operated by foot pedals. I've watched them cut 1/2" up to 2" copper pipe with it. They cut the copper into 12" pieces and then toss them into a gaylord for #1 copper. Any solder joints are cut out and put in a separate gaylord for #2 copper.

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Originally Posted by jimicrk

One of the yards I go to has something with jaws that look like a huge pair of bolt cutters operated by foot pedals. I've watched them cut 1/2" up to 2" copper pipe with it. They cut the copper into 12" pieces and then toss them into a gaylord for #1 copper. Any solder joints are cut out and put in a separate gaylord for #2 copper.

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Some yards use that machine to clean dirty brass as well

I would think a person could move through a pile fairly quick with this.

Throatless Shear

I took one of my old chop saws and installed a 10" metal cutting blade. It's NOT the right thing for the job but it works and it was cheap.

For copper you might be able to get away with a regular carbide tipped blade. Just be sure to wear good leather gloves, hearing protection, and a face shield -or- eye protection.

Edited to add: As for the guys not listening ? Couple of things you could do.

Pick the leader out of the bunch and make sure he gets all of the worst job assignments. Make him break up copper for a week.

The other thing would be to send someone home for the day. Just say ... you're not listening so i can't use you today. The loss of a day's pay will eventually get him to smarten up.

Don't be an ass though ... if you're pressing the guys to produce more you have to expect that the quality of their work will drop.

Yeah I was thinking about something like that.
I cut a table saw with a grinder blade on it, but it jacks the pipes around a lot and does not feel safe. Also then you have to pick up all the pieces.
That throatless sheeer thing looks interesting as well.
Thanks for all the input

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Originally Posted by jimicrk

One of the yards I go to has something with jaws that look like a huge pair of bolt cutters operated by foot pedals. I've watched them cut 1/2" up to 2" copper pipe with it. They cut the copper into 12" pieces and then toss them into a gaylord for #1 copper. Any solder joints are cut out and put in a separate gaylord for #2 copper.

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I used to have a chop saw designed to cut metal. stronger motors or different rpms I guess. worked great on many things. especially pole-ish metal (anything resembling a pole)

One thing I KNOW is grinding wheels and copper, brass, Al do NOT mix. Why? Grinding wheels will load up with the soft material and get hot. Hot grinding wheel loaded with soft metal equals a grinding wheel spinning at a high speed which has exploded in the past.

Now I don't know if this would or could occur using cut off wheel but I do recommend caution. 73 Mike

Yes they do explode....... been there, done that as they say. When cutting metals with a chop saw, I have a brick handy. I watch the blade for build up, when I see it, I do a quick cut on the brick. Cleans it right up. Blades $5 bucks a piece : Bricks 25 cents each. 1 brick last with me about 2-3 weeks. But my cutting time vary week by week.

The throatless shear is looking like the best ( and safest ) choice.

I wouldn't recommend it, but i use my finish carpentry chop saw with a sixty tooth carbide blade for cutting copper and aluminum drip edge. The soft metals don't seem to bother the blade any. A carbide blade will even tolerate the occasional nail bedded in a piece of wood.

Table saws are tricky. They're okay for rip cuts but they aren't well suited for cross cuts.

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Originally Posted by Scrappah

I took one of my old chop saws and installed a 10" metal cutting blade. It's NOT the right thing for the job but it works and it was cheap.

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I've done the same, ending up with copper dust everywhere. Plus who knows what "value" I'm losing. Probably not much. I may give the shear a try. Even though every use I've seen is for sheet stock, I assume it would work on tubing? Milwaukee makes a cordless cutter for MCM cable. Looks impressive. I assume it would work for tubing, but it's an expensive tool.

Although we only live once, right?! Plus I don't have a wife to answer to. I better get my tools while I can.

I think many good ideas have been presented but I don't think they address the real issue and that is Aph's guys/employees are not doing what he has told them to do.

If I have assumed wrong or if I'm off base, I apologize. I know nothing about owning or running a business and probably couldn't if I had one dropped in my lap.

I do know how people are and some will take advantage of others in a minute.

Often on big jobs there will be 3 or 4 techs and one has to be lead tech. I take lead a lot because the other guys don't want the responsibility. I assign different tasks to techs and it's up to them to get it done. If they don't then I address the problem immediately.

Aph, I think 2 dozen doughtnuts and a Monday morning meeting would be a whole lot cheaper than any new tool.

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Originally Posted by jimicrk

I think many good ideas have been presented but I don't think they address the real issue and that is Aph's guys/employees are not doing what he has told them to do.

If I have assumed wrong or if I'm off base, I apologize. I know nothing about owning or running a business and probably couldn't if I had one dropped in my lap.

I do know how people are and some will take advantage of others in a minute.

Often on big jobs there will be 3 or 4 techs and one has to be lead tech. I take lead a lot because the other guys don't want the responsibility. I assign different tasks to techs and it's up to them to get it done. If they don't then I address the problem immediately.

Aph, I think 2 dozen doughtnuts and a Monday morning meeting would be a whole lot cheaper than any new tool.

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You are def correct there.
I do let little things slide here and there and then it turns into a big (pile of half assed processed non-ferrous).
I am not always around and have 7 m,illion other things going on at any given time.
Addressing the problem with the employees will have to be the one big step I somehow have to figure out.
Not using that as an excuse, but it is VERY hard finding any good employee in Central Valley of California.
Regardless what job I am hiring for, LITERALLY half the people don't even show up for interviews. And that with 10% unemployment.
And then most feel friggin entitled.
Unfortunately you have to literally be happy if you find someone that is 80% ok in their performance.
Yes, it is THAT bad around here.

I am going to make a small baler for home shop use out of some scrap metal I have in order to bale my copper that does take up lots of space. I am planning on using an 18 inch long piece of heavy wall (say 1/4 inch) square tubing maybe 10 inch ID. I have bigger tubing but that seems to be a good starting point. I have a flat piece of one inch thick steel that will be trimmed to fit in the tubing ID to be the crusher panel and one piece of steel (does not have to be one inch) welded to the bottom. There will also be a thinner (1/4 inch thick minimum) flat piece of steel sitting below the bale. The bottom will have three or four 3/4 inch holes drilled in it (any size holes you want. I am going with 3/4) so it's possible to drive out the bale if it gets stuck. (this is where the thinner piece under the bale comes in to play). Kind of hard to drive against something soft like copper. I have all kinds of number one and two copper but it's various sizes and lengths. I use a harbor freight cable cutter ($14.00 on sale) to easily chop even one inch copper tube in to managable sizes. Most of my copper scrap is already doubled over and will easily fit in the 18 inch depth of the tubing. I have a 20 ton shop press. After dropping the press base down set the baler on it. I have a supply of diesel engine wrist pins various lengths I use on my press. Very strong but other solid steel rod will work or even steel punches at least an inch in diameter. More than strong enough to push down the compactor plate and the copper downward until it stops. Not much pressure is needed. Don't want to smash the copper to death. Just compact it some so it's easier to stack and store and remain identifiable. I plan on compacting it then adding more and crushing it again until I have close to an 18 bale each time. Just one of my ideas to make my life easier. The scrap I will be using to make it cost me nothing. Just stuff I was given to haul away. Forgot to ad. Some kind of lift handle or threaded hole a handle can be threaded in to must be added to the crusher panel so it can be lifted back out.

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Originally Posted by aph

I keep telling my guys to cut down, clean up non-ferrous as they go along, but nobody listens.
I have a big pile of copper lines, mostly from dishwashers and they take up a crapload of space.
I crimp and bend them into 6-8 inch pieces so much more weight fits into the buckets.
But it is tideous boring A.F. work.
So I was thinking, is there a small scale metal shredder that would shred my #2 copper lines into smaller chunks?
I would be willing to pay a few 100 bucks for it since it would save so much time in the long run.
TIA
Martin

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Make sure your bale is a loose bale or the yard may not want to buy it in case there is something hidden inside. I had a guy bring me a 4x4x2" block of copper that he baled really tight in an oil filter press. After he left I was looking at it and there was some brass mixed through it that I didn't see when buying it. We made an alligator shear out of some steel plate, thick pipe, truck rim, small cylinder and an old hydraulic power pack that we got in the scrap. works good for what we do with it (chop and clean copper/brass/aluminum). You can take a roll of 3/8 copper and make a cut through the whole roll on both sides then place the two halves together and make a cut through it all at once.

Yea just a loose bale. Like I said I did not want to crush the devil out of the copper. Just make it more managable and easier to store. I have actually done this before and light can be seen through the bale. Oil filter crushers have some guts for sure. They can flatten the toughest filters. Thanks for the advice though.

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Originally Posted by myekem

Make sure your bale is a loose bale or the yard may not want to buy it in case there is something hidden inside. I had a guy bring me a 4x4x2" block of copper that he baled really tight in an oil filter press. After he left I was looking at it and there was some brass mixed through it that I didn't see when buying it. We made an alligator shear out of some steel plate, thick pipe, truck rim, small cylinder and an old hydraulic power pack that we got in the scrap. works good for what we do with it (chop and clean copper/brass/aluminum). You can take a roll of 3/8 copper and make a cut through the whole roll on both sides then place the two halves together and make a cut through it all at once.

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Originally Posted by aph

You are def correct there.
I do let little things slide here and there and then it turns into a big (pile of half assed processed non-ferrous).
I am not always around and have 7 m,illion other things going on at any given time.
Addressing the problem with the employees will have to be the one big step I somehow have to figure out.
Not using that as an excuse, but it is VERY hard finding any good employee in Central Valley of California.
Regardless what job I am hiring for, LITERALLY half the people don't even show up for interviews. And that with 10% unemployment.
And then most feel friggin entitled.
Unfortunately you have to literally be happy if you find someone that is 80% ok in their performance.
Yes, it is THAT bad around here.

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I wish I woulda read this Thread back when Western Express dumped me off out there. I'm trying to find a junkyard job currently. And with that being said you can't always expect everyone to look good on paper. Sometimes the best employees you'll find are the ones that look horrible on that black and white slip they hand you, mostly cause they'll be desperate to keep that job. And I don't see why unemployment makes people wanna not hire someone. Not everyone thats unemployed is unemployed because of their choosing, and the one thing that makes unemployment harder to get get out of is that no one wants to hire you when your unemployed. I've been struggling for like a whole year now to find a job after I got out of the army. I was so broke for awhile I kept taking jobs I really wasnt good at, or couldnt afford to stay at long and now its even harder to find a job since i didn't perform well at my last 3 jobs and pretty much got fired. Does this affect my performance at my next job? No but alot of HR reps/ possible future employers beg to differ. Ive had 8 different jobs in 2016, and after this temp thing is over with the state it looks like I might be going full time as a scrapper again. And I'll probably have to collect unemployment as well even though I'm sort of against collecting from the tax payers. It'll be **** near impossible to get a job with someone other than SWIFT then. Even though I'm honest and work hard as $hit people would rather hire the lazy lying sack of crap that looks better on paper than hire me.