It is here...

**Ewasted** · 12-14-2011, 11:18 AM

The feared market landslide is upon us... any guesses where this will bottom out before the new year?? Gold is down almost 8% today, Silver is down almost 8% today, Copper is down over $.30 since Monday...

My fear is the market may not come back to the highs we have just witnessed, unless of course speculators drive the price up.

Thoughts?

**hdbillf** · 12-14-2011, 11:24 AM

I dont understand could you please explain what it is that your talking about
Thanks hdbillf

**miked** · 12-14-2011, 11:31 AM

My fortune is in totes in the back yard right now. My concern is the short term gold market. New shipment coming to you soon, Mike.

**EcoSafe** · 12-14-2011, 11:34 AM

You may well be right. as I understand the way gold prices are supposed to work is. oil goes up gold goes up. money value gets shakey or goes down gold goes up. currency value improves gold goes down. this has to be one of 2 things either the big players ( mega billionair banksters) are profit taking or the bubble has burst on PMs. world currencies are dropping every where particularly the euro, which I believe is toast any way, many countries are worse off then us economacly, this should drive the security of gold and there fore the price up, but it is dropping instead, if the trend continues the only explination is a bubble, if that is the case, its katy bar the door. just my .02

**Ewasted** · 12-14-2011, 11:34 AM

Gold was supposed to be the hedge investment for currencies... possessively the drop is being connected with the Euro.

**jaydisco** · 12-14-2011, 11:52 AM

Wow, hope you are hedging! Sell puts or something...

I agree that gold should remain under pressure, but I think a 20% decline is unlikely in the next two-and-a-half weeks.

One of the reasons for all of the pressure on gold is the dollar's strength vs. the euro. That coupled with the Fed shying away from more quantitative easing (points to stronger U.S. economy). That being said, I feel that these factors are already "baked in the cake", meaning: gold prices have already adjusted. The market is extremely efficient at discounting news as it is known.

I think year-end we will still be above 1500.

**jaydisco** · 12-14-2011, 11:59 AM

Mark Hulbert citing strong contrarian indicators that point to gold rally:

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/the...wel-2011-12-14

**EcoSafe** · 12-14-2011, 01:24 PM

all of the above should tell you exactly where the world economy is. As much as the world profffesses to hate America. the current trend speaks vollums about what they actually think of America and the American way. They are turning from universal value (gold) to fiat value in a currency that is in debt 15 trillion as of today. It is not faith in the dollar but faith in the American people to once again pull the world butts out of the toilet. They have faith no matter what the world banksters do the American people will sooner or later wake up and once again take up the banner and lead the charge back up the hill. I hope they are right this time too.

**EcoSafe** · 12-14-2011, 03:51 PM

A point which I agree with. however the world looks at us in time of their need and greed and judge us from past performance.

**Ry4nscr4p** · 12-14-2011, 04:19 PM

I was under the impression, at least for myself, to buy gold as a security for when the Monetary system collapses and I need to trade something for food/water/ammo. To base a standard, acuall, commodity (precious metals) against...well not such a stable standard isn't really comparing apples to apples. At least not in my book, the money isn't real anymore, it's like going into your monopoly box and spending it-no real value.

Most will probably disregard what I say about it, but to those who understand the bigger picture, I'm not stocking up for "retirement"

**EcoSafe** · 12-14-2011, 04:45 PM

the rule of unintended consequences come in to play with gold as currency. 1. every one who slls has to be an assayer. if you think counterfitting currency creats a problem, with gold you aint seen nothin yet. gold usually comes in a form that prohibits usual trading. for example you need a can of coffee a loaf of bread, and a dozen eggs, so you flip that kogerand or ounce bar on the counter, how are you going to get your change and in what form will it be. every one will not have a gram ,grain or penney weight scale and 1490 dollars change for a small purchase could present problems, not withstanding lead plugs drilled weights ect. Silver I believe is a much safer and easier method of security and trade. if silver drops 20 % you lost 4$. if gold drops 20% you lost 400$. but the most aluable commodity of all is your skills. I buy junk silver dimes and quarters when I can.

**scrapdollar** · 12-14-2011, 05:40 PM

As far as currency goes, I would be in favor of bring back US Notes(USN) and get rid of the Federal Reserve Notes(FRN).

The reason being is that US notes are interest free and FRNs are not.

**bpatnoe** · 12-14-2011, 08:15 PM

As a numismatic I check out silver and gold prices daily. I have mixed feelings about the huge drop. One one hand (numismatic) I love seeing more coins now going for collector value instead of PM value. On the other hand (scrapping) it is going to be hard to see the updated price list. My big thing is that I scrap for my collecting. I am happy to say that any "junk" silver coins I bought over the past 2 years I turned around quickly so I did not loose money.

I think that there is still security in putting some silver and gold away for retirement but I am going more for collector coins instead.

**Mechanic688** · 12-14-2011, 09:23 PM

Oh Also Know how to make Booze Because it don't matter what the Economic times Bring People like to Drink.

Like homemade balloon wine,, LOL

**easyrecycle** · 12-14-2011, 09:33 PM

Yeas gold is dropping like a rock but at this time of year gold drops real bad but comes back up at the start of the year. Now I would state that gold dropped a bit more and a bit faster than I had thought. But gold stay in the upper 1700s longer than I thought it would.

But look on kitco. com at the 5, 10 year. Gold will drop at this time but will pick right back up.

**parrothead** · 12-14-2011, 10:39 PM

Originally Posted by easyrecycle

Yeas gold is dropping like a rock but at this time of year gold drops real bad but comes back up at the start of the year. Now I would state that gold dropped a bit more and a bit faster than I had thought. But gold stay in the upper 1700s longer than I thought it would.

But look on kitco. com at the 5, 10 year. Gold will drop at this time but will pick right back up.

I am with you on that. It is a too hard and too fast drop to not go up at least half way in a day or two time. Crossing fingers and knocking on wood. However, a sustained drop in gold would lead to the presence of an actual recovery. So there are mixed emotions on this. I will take the current stance that there is just some profit taking right now and we shall see a fairly quick rebound of at least half the loss as soon as the drop stops.

**parrothead** · 12-14-2011, 10:51 PM

On the other hand, if the economy rebounds and all of the factories open up and all of the people go back to work, there will be a larger demand for all goods as well as metals including precious ones. This would also lead to a higher demand in oil which sucks and will keep the economy down as the demand for oil increases with the increased economy. It is almost a catch 22 with no way out. I wish that if the current adminstration were going to spend money just to spend and spur the economy, that it would all be toward alternative energy. I am thinking at this point that an energy revolution may be the only way out of this world wide mess we are in right now. That or somehow fixing the price of a barrel of oil at say....$80 for 5 years or something along those lines.

If the fed would support a full blown factory that could pump out solar cells or research on better(lighter, cheaper) batteries, or a windmill factory, I think it would be a very short time before we saw a turn around. Because if we get one now (a turn around), the demand for oil WILL go up and therefore keep the economy right back down.

take the fuel out of the hands of the part of the world that is always at war and put it in the hands of the people via affordable solar cells, windmills, hydrogen cells and the list goes on. Putting that power in the hands of the people would turn the world right back around so fast it would make your head spin.

This is all just in my humble opinion of course.

**parrothead** · 12-14-2011, 10:52 PM

Heh, I just created a new meaning to the term ""power" to the people". I may have to take that and run with it.

**Mechanic688** · 12-15-2011, 02:10 AM

Course we all know that the price of oil is not because of supply and demand but those people buying and selling oil on the stockmarket, taking their profits by running the prices up.

**rbrooks715** · 12-21-2011, 12:16 PM

in dec of 09 gold was sitting around $1100 silver was $17
in dec of 10 gold was around $1400 silver was $30
now we have gold around $1600. silver is $29

most predict higher gold by the second quarter of 11. due to economics and depreciating money.

the economy is a factor in the current price swings, but speculation plays a larger role at the moment. but if the economy were to improve, we would be using even more gold in manufacturing. driving the price up. the same reason platinum, palladium, silver, copper is down. less of it is being used in manufactured consumables. simply because we are consuming less. we consume less because we have fewer consumers. too many unemployed and under employed.