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Can't Get Any Worse....

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  1. #1
    matador started this thread.
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    Can't Get Any Worse....

    We're usually ahead of everyone on price drops, so read with a little grain of salt....

    Today, I dropped off a few computer cases at the local yard and picked up some farm equipment parts (They let me look at any equipment that comes in- I'm a farmer, so I've scored a few tires and parts this way). I was chatting with the yard head while the tires were being pulled for me. Shred is currently at $20/Ton, heavy at $40/Ton, and prepared at $60/Ton. He told me that next week will be the last week that they'll pay for shred or heavy. After that, they'll take it, but there won't be a payout. They're not hauling much of anything out until the prices rise (They're on about 40 acres- out here, they have the space).

    Not a pretty sight....

    More than Scrap Value Shipment Tips: http://www.scrapmetalforum.com/scrap...tml#post242349

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  3. #2
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  5. #3
    matador started this thread.
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    That doesn't actually sound too far from the other yards in the area actually. The larger one in Billings is around $40/Ton (As of last month), so this seems reasonable as we're in a small, isolated area. They're basically just a feeder yard to the large one.

    I don't haul much shred anyways. What I took in today may have been worth $0.09. The next yard is 100 miles away, so I'm not hauling small loads of cases there. I just need the space, and it's either this or the dumpster. I'd rather give them to a recycler than put them in the landfill.

    Plus, I got two implement tires for the price of mounting at the local tire shop.

    It's safe to say that they won't be getting any large loads from me, though!

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    Do they buy much non-ferrous?? Otherwise, no payments going out, no inputs coming in unless someone just wants a place to get rid of awkward steel. They may have the room to store but no cash flow means things start shutting down. I doubt the can get their electricity on credit for too long...

  8. #5
    matador started this thread.
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    They buy some. From what I understand, they're owned by a trucking company that uses the yard as a tax write off more than anything. Today, there was only one guy at the yard (Usually there are two, but it was 3 a few months ago), because the company had the other one driving a semi to drop off a machine for them.

    We had one other yard in town that closed (Health reasons supposedly, but I have my doubts there), so I think they just started doing it as a way to get some use out of their land. They have some farm equipment in, but strangely only three vehicles. They usually have many more. Maybe they just hauled a load out, though?

    I'm not good at reading signs, but the impression I got was that they would basically just pile everything up and keep expenses very low. They're obviously hurting compared to what they were doing, but I think the parent company doesn't care too much, as they own the land (It's a worthless spot), the trucks, and can always pull someone who has a CDL.

    It's weird though. I hope they don't close for a while- our nearest yard then then would be either 125 miles away, or 125 miles away in another state!
    Last edited by matador; 09-10-2015 at 12:59 AM. Reason: Typo Made Phrase Awkward

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    If you keep giving them your steel they will eventually need to sell, and then hopefully start buying from you again. As said better than the landfill, and it could get worse they start charging you to take your steel...

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    Maybe get a rolloff dropped off for steel?
    Could be an option.

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    Ok so if Sirscrap comes in and sees this upcoming comment he'll "give me the business" but I don't care.

    Yesterday I got the opportunity to purchase 500 lbs of hard drives without boards. I was able to get them for .25/lb as I can run them to my buyer and get .45/lb without touching them.. easy peasey right? I load the van and head to the buyer.. they stopped buying copper, brass, aluminum, even electric motors "about a month ago" Went to another buyer that my initial buyer recommended, guy had no idea how to grade them so he is talking to his brother to find out a price.

    Called my local e-waste recycler- .10/lb

    Headed back to town and hit the local scrap yard.. they offered to pay .15 as "breakage" So as of this writing I have 500 lbs of stuff I may very well be taking a loss on.

    Never in my 25 years of scrapping have I ever seen scrapping conditions like this. Anyone can say what they will but this is about the biggest freefall of h-e-l-l in prices and lack of demand that I have encountered in my lifetime.

    Buyer #1 had 2 on staff (where they usually have 4)
    Buyer #2 had 1 office guy doing everything (but there wasn't much to do as I seemed like the only guy who showed up all day)
    I'm so into scrapping.. When my Steel Toe Boots Wear out, I cut the Steel out of them and recycle the Toe!

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    Quote Originally Posted by sledge View Post
    Ok so if Sirscrap comes in and sees this upcoming comment he'll "give me the business" but I don't care.

    Yesterday I got the opportunity to purchase 500 lbs of hard drives without boards. I was able to get them for .25/lb as I can run them to my buyer and get .45/lb without touching them.. easy peasey right? I load the van and head to the buyer.. they stopped buying copper, brass, aluminum, even electric motors "about a month ago" Went to another buyer that my initial buyer recommended, guy had no idea how to grade them so he is talking to his brother to find out a price.

    Called my local e-waste recycler- .10/lb

    Headed back to town and hit the local scrap yard.. they offered to pay .15 as "breakage" So as of this writing I have 500 lbs of stuff I may very well be taking a loss on.

    Never in my 25 years of scrapping have I ever seen scrapping conditions like this. Anyone can say what they will but this is about the biggest freefall of h-e-l-l in prices and lack of demand that I have encountered in my lifetime.

    Buyer #1 had 2 on staff (where they usually have 4)
    Buyer #2 had 1 office guy doing everything (but there wasn't much to do as I seemed like the only guy who showed up all day)
    Makes you want to get rid of everything, scary

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  17. #10
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    Guys, I feel your pain ! I just went to the yard last week ( In CT ) and it was sad. I made little more than gas money. Sent in 3 boxes of E-waste to clean out an area in preparation for cold weather processing
    and I do't have high hopes for the kind of checks we were all used to seeing.
    So at this point ( and I really never thought it would come to this ) I am going to start staggering my shipments instead of weeks , possibly months in hopes that things may rebound.
    Also, since I have the option I will concentrate more again on my DJ and Photobooth business ! Anyone getting married ? Having a party ?

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  19. #11
    matador started this thread.
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    Oh wait, this isn't the clubhouse. Well, I guess I'm trolling my own thread now....

    ----------------------

    I literally hauled in nine computer shells. That won't justify a rolloff. I actually own four road-legal trucks, so that's not an issue. It doesn't pay gas money, though, so I haul what I can in the car, because I work within two miles of the yard anyways. A trip a day makes the yard look a little cleaner and gives me more space.

    I was more than happy with the implement tires I got. New farm implement tires are about $200 a piece- $20 is a lot better! I figure that throwing a little shred their way is a nice gesture.

    As some of you know, I deal in more than scrap (Computers and working components). Scrap metal is a very small part of what I do. If they start charging, though, they can forget it. I'll start hoarding then....

    Not a good sign of the times....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalvlin View Post
    Guys, I feel your pain ! I just went to the yard last week ( In CT ) and it was sad. I made little more than gas money. Sent in 3 boxes of E-waste to clean out an area in preparation for cold weather processing
    and I do't have high hopes for the kind of checks we were all used to seeing.
    So at this point ( and I really never thought it would come to this ) I am going to start staggering my shipments instead of weeks , possibly months in hopes that things may rebound.
    Also, since I have the option I will concentrate more again on my DJ and Photobooth business ! Anyone getting married ? Having a party ?
    mic check 1 2 ... 1 ....2 ...

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  23. #13
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    prices effective 8/31:


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    Update as of today on the Hard Drives:

    Called my normal Scrap yard and asked what they would pay. Guy says "Send me a Picture" So I did. He says "Great.. I'll pay .36/lb" I could hardly get in the van fast enough. So I make the 22 mile trek to the yard. Once I get there he says "Ohh well.. Those are crap" I said "What? I sent you pictures as you asked and you said you'd pay .36 lb for em!!" He goes "Nah.. let me check on price.. he comes back and says.. are you ready for this: .02 cents/lb.. Freakin LESS than sheet steel pricing for Aluminum cased hard drives. What the Frickin Frack!

    I close the doors of the van and head north.. back to the guy who was trying to get me pricing yesterday.. I tell him "Listen I'll sell them at the sheet price you gave me yesterday (.30/lb) he says "Well we are still trying to see if they may be worth more.. so why not load them off onto a skid and leave them here and we can get you a price on Monday" Really dude.. what do I look like some noob?

    Back into the van.. further north. Stop at the local yard I hate.. they offered me .15 lb as "Aluminum breakage" So I sucked it up, loaded em off and took my lumps. After being offered .02/lb for em and another place having no clue until Monday.. I just ate the $hit sandwich and chalked it up to experience!

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  26. #15
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    only one way to go from the bottom..guess it's the only good part about being there.
    There ain't nothing wrong with an honest days work. Anyone who says otherwise is a fool.- Old Man

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  28. #16
    sledge's Avatar
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    NH: Still feels like they have more room to go.
    Here is the part that really burns me arse. As part of my bread and butter gig I am responsible for the inventory at a duplex community, I receive and stock all the items we utilize in the complex. As prices for our hard earned scrap has gone down.. the prices of our materials that utilize that scrap have gone UP!

    Examples you say: Sure thing!
    Aluminum Bifold Door Track- was $11.68 1 year ago.. now $14.69
    Pop-Up Assembly (Brass) was $5.02 1 year ago.. now $8.46
    TOILET SUPPLY Line 12" Was $4.04 now $4.13
    TOILET CLOSET BOLTS (2 PK) Brass Coated Steel- Was .63 now .82
    Steel Mailbox: Was $13.18 now $15.56
    Steel Bi-Fold Door- Was $64.60 now $85.05

    And the list goes on and on. What does that tell us? It means that we are paid less and less for the scrap to regenerate into materials to create new products.. but yet the manufacturers are charging MORE.. not less for their end products. I don't see this as a "downturn" I see a bigger picture of a huge SQUEEZE on everyone in this industry.. from us the small guys all the way up the chain. Companies have to be demanding raw materials at lower prices and thus.. with the "trickle effect" it rolls down to us. I see a bigger problem than this supposed "It's all China's fault" I call B.S. on that.

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  30. #17
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    What i found with my business was that the volume of work dropped when the recession hit.

    I sell skilled carpentry in one hour units. Pre-recession i might have been selling 2200 units per year. Post recession that volume dropped to below 1000 units per year.

    The only way to stay in business was to gradually double my hourly labor rate.

    There are volume discounts for the larger customers that provide many hours of work because i can do those jobs more efficiently.

    ========

    It would be the same for someone selling closet bolts or bi fold doors. Slower economy, less consumer demand, the greater the need to increase profit on what units you are able to sell.

    Eventually it gets to a point where you've priced yourself out of the market.

    That's where the deflationary phase kicks in & prices drop. If you are running a business your margin of profit gets narrower & narrower till there's no profit at all in doing a certain thing. At that point your business goes under and you have to shut down operations.

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    How's down 20 or more next month sound? It's no longer the yards dictating the prices the mills can basically push the price down at will and find sellers no matter what because the yards need cash flow to operate. The only good part is new steel is cheaper and cheaper by the day. Only good if your in the construction or fabrication business and bid jobs months ago. The margin just increased for them. The scrap industry is getting bent over with no lube tho.

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  34. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by jiffy117 View Post
    prices effective 8/31:

    Port of Albany location was about 10 per gt lower today.

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    I spoke to someone today who told me the top-paying yard around here is dropping their light iron pricing from $80 down to $40 a ton effective this coming Monday. I just started collecting pallets and am testing the waters with that, if it goes well I might focus on that alot more than scrap until prices come back up again, whenever that may be.


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