Direct To Refiners

Good Morning,

Im new tho this Forum and electronics recycling. One issue my business partner and i just cant seem to understand is this precious metal side of the electronics recycling. We have seen a lot of info on how to sort different types of boards (which is overwhelming to us) from what we assume these are middleman buyers.

What is the advantage of using a board "buyer", what are they doing with the material? Has anyone sent there product to a refiner like Sabin, do you still need to sort materials when sending to a refiner? We started our business in January and have approx 6 Gaylords of motherboards, telecom and finger boards ready to ship. Our intention is to wait until we have a full truck load before we sell this material.

I guess what i'm asking is for some advice, assuming we have a minimum of 20 Gaylords where do we get our best bang for our buck?

You need legal contracts, and a lot of documentation. You can easily get #ed over by a refiner if you do not have your legal 'ducks in a row'.
Also - boards have way more than silver/gold/platinum family metals in them. You have copper, aluminum, real tin, nickle, lead, tantalum, cobalt, and many other recoverable metals.

Forget the refinery, assuming you have a minimum of 20 Gaylords ship to a copper smelter.

Smelter pays out on copper, gold, silver and three of the platinum sisters - platinum, palladium and rhodium.

https://s3.postimg.org/ulrvta0ar/copper.png

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RLS0812

You need legal contracts, and a lot of documentation. You can easily get #ed over by a refiner if you do not have your legal 'ducks in a row'.
Also - boards have way more than silver/gold/platinum family metals in them. You have copper, aluminum, real tin, nickle, lead, tantalum, cobalt, and many other recoverable metals.

---

Speaking from experience?

I am too small to get involved in the concept of me sending directly to a refiner. I concentrate on doing what I do best, locating, breaking down and sorting of ewaste. I let my buyer(s) to do what they do best.

If you want to learn about sorting/grading of boards read more of the threads here and you will pick it up eventually. If your volume warrants it hire one of the other members to come and teach you.
73, Mike

Greetings and welcome to the forum. You might want to post a little intro about yourself and the such in the "intro" thread. Also, you have been given some really good advice already but I would like to add a little thought.

If you and your business partner are new to the field, I would strongly suggest that you start with those "middleman" buyers, like the ones here on the forum, and learn as you go, unless you have a boatload of money at your disposal, because learning as you go, you will make mistakes, but you will only make them once. You will also find out if you really want to make that step to the next level.

I had the same thoughts as you in wanting to have my material shipped directly to refiners but after starting out in scrapping, it stayed at the get, sort, sell and start over routine. Unless you have a department of workers for the paperwork that will have to be handled, you should start here and work you way up the hill.

Just imo. Happy scrapping

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by alloy2

Forget the refinery, assuming you have a minimum of 20 Gaylords ship to a copper smelter.

Smelter pays out on copper, gold, silver and three of the platinum sisters - platinum, palladium and rhodium.

https://s3.postimg.org/ulrvta0ar/copper.png

---

Home - Accueil | Fonderie Horne

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Paveitall

Good Morning,

Im new tho this Forum and electronics recycling. One issue my business partner and i just cant seem to understand is this precious metal side of the electronics recycling. We have seen a lot of info on how to sort different types of boards (which is overwhelming to us) from what we assume these are middleman buyers.

What is the advantage of using a board "buyer", what are they doing with the material? Has anyone sent there product to a refiner like Sabin, do you still need to sort materials when sending to a refiner? We started our business in January and have approx 6 Gaylords of motherboards, telecom and finger boards ready to ship. Our intention is to wait until we have a full truck load before we sell this material.

I guess what i'm asking is for some advice, assuming we have a minimum of 20 Gaylords where do we get our best bang for our buck?

---

Hello!
We are buyers here on the forum with a lot of refinery experience. Best bang for your buck is going to be in excess of 5,000,000 lbs a year.

A few questions I would have would be:
When you go to Walmart, do you try to buy your products direct to avoid Walmart, the middleman?
If not, why not?
What value does Walmart bring to the table?

Do you current work with a scrap yard?
Do you try to sell your steel direct to the mill?
If not, why not?
What value does the yard bring to the table?

My intent wasn't to offend buyers like Ewasted so my apologies maybe i posted this question to the wrong forum I though this was a site to help scrapers find outlets for products. We are in an area of the country with very few or no buyers of Ewaste (haven't found a local one yet). I have an outlet for the steel, copper and aluminum at out local "traditional" scrap yards. What we struggle with is the precious metal bearing materials, if there was someone close i would certainly consider selling thru a middleman or dealer, but if i need to ship this stuff 800-1,000 miles and i have a full truck load why wouldn't i go direct to the refiner?

As Ewasted pointed out, if i want to buy 1 or 2 watermelons i will go to my local wal-mart or grocery store, but if i need an whole truckload i might consider talking with a farmer. Has anyone here shipped direct? If so who?

You are asking if anyone has shipped direct to a buyer. Ewasted is a buyer. Look at his thread in the buyer section, and you will see his prices and all the satisfied transactions.

I say go for it....pick one off google search and send it in.....im just kidding....ewasted is a great option for us dealing in thousands of pounds per month as well as other buyers here.....personally having this stuff refined does not really interest me....the US $ is still strong and probably will be for my lifetime....ill continue to sell to buyers here but it would be interesting to read your results after u go to refinery....others have posted and they actually made less than shipping to forum buyers

I also sell direct to refiner. Its a long learning process and this is something most people wont talk about on the open forum. If your just starting out I would sell to one of the buyers here on the forum. Asa buyer here myself I started out selling to these buyers until I learned the business. Now I am also a buyer on here as well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Paveitall

My intent wasn't to offend buyers like Ewasted so my apologies maybe i posted this question to the wrong forum I though this was a site to help scrapers find outlets for products. We are in an area of the country with very few or no buyers of Ewaste (haven't found a local one yet). I have an outlet for the steel, copper and aluminum at out local "traditional" scrap yards. What we struggle with is the precious metal bearing materials, if there was someone close i would certainly consider selling thru a middleman or dealer, but if i need to ship this stuff 800-1,000 miles and i have a full truck load why wouldn't i go direct to the refiner?

As Ewasted pointed out, if i want to buy 1 or 2 watermelons i will go to my local wal-mart or grocery store, but if i need an whole truckload i might consider talking with a farmer. Has anyone here shipped direct? If so who?

---

I have been doing ewaste for a number of years now. This year, I did my 1st full truck load. It was only 30 pallets. Had I double stacked them, could have done 60. I also used smaller than normal gaylords. My cost to ship over 500 miles wad about 4 cents per pound. So I wouldn't let that be a deciding factor.
The major benefit that I see in dealing with a buyer, is getting paid in a short amount of time. A couple of weeks with a buyer on here verses waiting for the refining process to be done.

Also, to add to a few posts, 5 million pounds a year is a massive amount, Unless you are a buyer with that kind of volume, you most likely will not see the amount of money you think. I had contacted a plastics refiner here in the Chicago area some years ago by accident looking for a plastics buyer, and the girl that I was talking to gave me the minimums that they deal with, we are talking like 3 to 4 semi's a week, constantly and bailed.

Even shipping a truckload of motherboards to one of the buyers here would be well worth your startup and the shipping can also go through someone here, I seem to remember there used to be a member that had specials for full truckloads and he had his own carriage company or something like that.

Now nobody knows the size of your operation or the actual quantity that you are receiving but if you are just getting into the business of e-waste, you need to take the steps to get to the next level.

Also if you became a paid member, you would have access to the closed section and there has been a lot of this sorta thing discussed in there, an open forum, like this thread, will not get you the answers you so desire. Like I recommended in an earlier post, introduce yourself, give people a little background on you and your business and fill in your profile as much as you can, then get your paid lifetime membership, the best money I spent, and start doing the research through the old treads, we all have done it.

I can't speak for anyone else here on the forum, but for me, I was just adding my trials and mishaps with wanting to go big and had a rude awakening, which is why I stuck with the "get, sort, sell, start over" attitude. It pays really quick and it keeps me working, usually. Everyone just seems to be trying to help you move forward, sitting on Gaylord's of product waiting to find a refiner just doesn't seem cost effective, unless you have a huge line of open credit. IMO.

Wasn't there a guy on here named Noblesomethingorother who used to be a ""hobbyist"" refiner?

I clearly remember him posting that if you send your stuff off to a refiner without being an 'insider' that you WILL get ripped off. Pure & simple. He said that you need a broker watching every step of the process and if you don't cross every T & dot every I, you might even end up OWING the refiner at the end of the deal.

Eff that.

I have a decent buyer here in DFW, and if I get enough of a particular item, I know a guy in Colorado & another one in Ohio that have always done me right.

Whaddayaknow... they're right up top on this link right now:

https://www.scrapmetalforum.com/scrap-buyers-sellers/

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by auminer

Wasn't there a guy on here named Noblesomethingorother who used to be a ""hobbyist"" refiner?

I clearly remember him posting that if you send your stuff off to a refiner without being an 'insider' that you WILL get ripped off. Pure & simple. He said that you need a broker watching every step of the process and if you don't cross every T & dot every I, you might even end up OWING the refiner at the end of the deal.

Eff that.

I have a decent buyer here in DFW, and if I get enough of a particular item, I know a guy in Colorado & another one in Ohio that have always done me right.

Whaddayaknow... they're right up top on this link right now:

https://www.scrapmetalforum.com/scrap-buyers-sellers/

---

See here is an old post that sounds appropriate for this. and it is the first one in the similar posts box. have a read, it may be a few years old, but you can't change the industry.

https://www.scrapmetalforum.com/gene...l-suggest.html

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tski72

See here is an old post that sounds appropriate for this. and it is the first one in the similar posts box. have a read, it may be a few years old, but you can't change the industry.

https://www.scrapmetalforum.com/gene...l-suggest.html

---

THERE'S someone who reads the old stuff!!!!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by auminer

THERE'S someone who reads the old stuff!!!!!

---

I read quite a bit of the old posts, that's why I do not start many threads, my questions have been answered. I just keep reading. I do what I recommend quite a bit. No hypocrite here.

Happy reading.

interesting topic.......Always made me wonder how the boards were purchased by the pound but the refinery does not purchase by LB but pays on yield.......Seems like to much margin for error for me..........I applaud those who use the refinery method and give some poor white boy like me a job to do

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ewasted

Hello!
We are buyers here on the forum with a lot of refinery experience. Best bang for your buck is going to be in excess of 5,000,000 lbs a year.

A few questions I would have would be:
When you go to Walmart, do you try to buy your products direct to avoid Walmart, the middleman?
If not, why not?
What value does Walmart bring to the table?

Do you current work with a scrap yard?
Do you try to sell your steel direct to the mill?
If not, why not?
What value does the yard bring to the table?

---

I sold my number one heavy melt directly to the mill, and my prepared scrap engine cast went direct to the foundry, I stuffed my scrap cars and trucks with white metal scrap.

My aluminum scrap went to a smelter. Stainless and copper of all grades went to the yard paying the most $$$,

Wallmart does nothing to enhance my buying experience while shopping on ebay buying from vendors located in China brings a smile to my face.