This is stressing me out.
I have a few air conditioners and a fridge I just picked up......I've only been doing this for a week or two.....I just read up on freon and all that...now I'm terrified.
What do you do? I know alot of guys cut them up and that's that....but I can't/won't do that.
How could I become certified to remove freon? I'm in a small town in Ontario, canada.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
Is testing them to see if they work and selling them on Craig's List an option? Are you sure the freon isn't already leaked out of any of them? You can look up the certification online.
If you are will to go through the expense and time to get certified for freon removal, not to mention the cost of the tools, you might as well just learn the trade. Then you could make the big bucks and still scrap on the side!
So is it worth it for the non-certified scrapper to pick up air conditioners and refrigerators? or is it more a waste of time and effort?
Getting certified is not too bad. There are a few online options for a type 1 certification, which allows to you to recover refrigerant with a pressure up to 5lbs. This would include 90% of what you would see. Equipment gets a little spendy, the pumps we use are $600 each but will last a long time. You need different gauges and hoses as well as tanks for each type of refrigerant. You cannot sell mixed refrigerant, however 99.5% pure refrigerants can be sold. For example Last time I sold r-12 I got $7.00/lb. In my opinion if you do it right it is a very good business. Fell free to pm me if you have any questions
The other option that has been discussed many times here is to work out a deal with an appliance repair center/person to pull the freon for you, for them keeping/selling the freon. Even if you have to pay them $5. for it. That would be the ecological way.
hi guys its worth getting the freon professionally removed as i picked up a few aircons last saturday and was told they were degassed, so once i got home it was raining so i was throwing the units off the truck as you do but one landed ontop off the other and it ruptured the copper lines to which they started pouring out gas, jumped off my truck to try and squash the pipe to stop the leak but i had no luck, so i just kept working unloading the other units.
i went in had my shower and sat on the lounge but when i went to get up i couldnt move, felt like my legs and arms had fallen asleep but real bad i seriously thought i was in trouble, my wife had to help get me to bed. im pretty sure it had to do with the freon as ive never felt like that before, woke up the next day and felt sore all over.
im treating all these units with caution however i still collect them as theyre a good money maker.
good luck guys!
I've never heard of anyone having a reaction like this to Freon. Could you have had a ministroke? Did you get checked out by a doctor?Quote:
Originally Posted by JNK
You could have broken one open that had a compressor burnout. Kinda sounds like you got a big whiff of phosgene.
I am fortunate enough to have an HVAC contractor in my complex just a few doors down from me, so I have a pretty good deal on the removal.
What no one is saying on here is that most scrappers don't bother with legal removal. They just cut the lines and let her blow. Not condoning it,
but when you're starving for every nickel that Freon capture fee can be hard to come up with.
The main reason they are not saying it though is because releasing the Freon is illegal, and there are stiff fines for doing so.
From the EPA's website:
Enforcement
EPA is performing random inspections, responding to tips, and pursuing potential cases against violators. Under the Act, EPA is authorized to assess fines of up to $37,500 per day for any violation of these regulations. Information on selected enforcement actions is available in the enforcement section.
The fact that the Freon danger is contrived is of no import. The fact you you can be fined out of business is.
This is why I won't deal with AC or fridges. It doesn't take much to harm you. To the original poster, get medical attention.Quote:
Originally Posted by freonjoe
I doubt the refrigerant (freon) caused your symptoms. From the history of Freon:
Because Freon is non-toxic, it eliminated the danger posed by refrigerator leaks. In just a few years, compressor refrigerators using Freon would become the standard for almost all home kitchens. In 1930, Thomas Midgley held a demonstration of the physical properties of Freon for the American Chemical Society by inhaling a lung-full of the new wonder gas and breathing it out onto a candle flame, which was extinguished, thus showing the gas's non-toxicity and non-flammable properties. Only decades later did people realize that such chlorofluorocarbons endangered the ozone layer of the entire planet.
The source: Freon - The History of Freon
However, as freonjoe and JPete pointed out, phosgene is very toxic.
But the phosgene from a burnout could cause it. Been there, done that.
Phosgene is an insidious poison as the odor may not be noticed and symptoms may be slow to appear.[15] The odor detection threshold for phosgene is 0.4 ppm, which is four times the Threshold Limit Value. Its high toxicity arises from the action of the phosgene on the proteins in the pulmonary alveoli, which are the site of gas exchange: their damage disrupts the blood-air barrier, causing suffocation. It reacts with the amines of the proteins, causing crosslinking via formation of urea-like linkages, in accord with the reactions discussed above. Phosgene detection badges are worn by those at risk of exposure
Here in Mesa Az the yard I sell to will no longer accept refrigerators. The guy said the shredder won't take them with compressors in them any longer. I have never messed with the working parts of the fridges. I have priced having someone with an EPA legal freon recovery machine pull the freon but he wanted $20 per fridge. Buying a used machine could cost 10K. Shred in the Phoenix area is always low and has been for a long time. The City of Mesa has a hazardous waste disposal place that accepts fridges with freon in them. They take two a day. I read the EPA fine for venting freon in to the air is $25K for the first offense. Double that for the second and jail time from there on. I was at that yard last week. The scrap pile that is normally huge and full of fridges had none. Not one refrigerator was seen.
I still have my Freon certification from the mechanic's job I retired from years ago but for the small scale recycler to get certified and buy equipment is not cost effective given what they are paying for shred. .