Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 58

Building a still

| Off Topic Discussions
  1. #1
    blackgold12 is offline Metal Recycling Entrepreneur
    blackgold12 started this thread.
    SMF Badges of Honor

    Member since
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    195
    Thanks
    54
    Thanked 121 Times in 79 Posts

    Building a still

    Thirty five gallon boiler with a reflux column feeding vapor to a condenser, everything made from 304 stainless, for mobility trailer mounted.

    Coolant for the condenser will be recycled through a refrigerated unit especially designed for the project, all the electrical needs will be supplied via an old Lister 6.5 Kw diesel generator running on recycled vegetable oil.



    The build is expected to come in well under $1000.00, and will be used to recover essential oils from various trees and plants.

    If alcohol is you thing a 35 gallon still would produce 5.6 quarts of pure hootch that would have to be cut to 40% bringing your total product to approximately 8 gallons.

    However I believe there's a safer profit to be had in producing essential oils, production measured in milliliters instead of gallons.
    Last edited by blackgold12; 08-03-2019 at 10:05 AM.

  2. The Following 3 Users say Thank You for This Post by blackgold12:



  3. #2
    blackgold12 is offline Metal Recycling Entrepreneur
    blackgold12 started this thread.
    SMF Badges of Honor

    Member since
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    195
    Thanks
    54
    Thanked 121 Times in 79 Posts
    I believe both canisters were used to spray a herbicide to get rid of any residue I fired both to a cherry red heat now both are filled with lye water which was heated making it more active.

    Need to get rid of the scale left behind after incineration, after discarding the lye water will add some fine gravel and water shake the contents vigorously discard then give it several more rounds.

    The larger canister will be used for the reflux column while the smaller one the water jacket for the condenser coil.

    When I'm done silver soldering and such both of those canisters will buff up nice and shiny better than new, stainless is so much more easier to clean than copper.

    Ozone or a strong source of UV light would have broken down the bad stuff inside those canisters.

    After processing my first run of oil will send a sample into the lab for analysis, we don't want any unwanted contaminants in the oil, that $35.00 laboratory fee is cheap insurance.

    Last edited by blackgold12; 08-04-2019 at 10:45 PM.

  4. #3
    t00nces2's Avatar
    SMF Badges of Honor


    Member since
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Sarasota, FL
    Posts
    1,296
    Thanks
    810
    Thanked 1,895 Times in 754 Posts
    What kind of essential oils are you going to make and where are you going to source your supplies? Is there any worries about impurities in the sourced materials that may be concentrated in the resulting oil? I would think pesticides and herbicides and fertilizers or local contaminants could be concentrated in the resulting product. I don't mean to criticize, I am asking because I would think that distilling oils would be harder than distilling alcohol and the result would be much more concentrated and less likely to dilute any unwanted impurities.

  5. #4
    eesakiwi's Avatar
    SMF Badges of Honor



    Member since
    Dec 2010
    Location
    NZ
    Posts
    2,367
    Thanks
    2,414
    Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,127 Posts
    Safrole oil from the Sassafras tree roots is worth a lot of money ;->

    Seriously though, some guys in NZ decided to extract oil from wild pine trees ( a nuisance plant if they start growing in the wild.) It turned into a good money maker.

    Fennel & lavender also sell well. Anything thats sought after due to 'fashion' or a craze ( like lavender )
    or as a chemical feedstock ( fennel ) would make a nice $ return.

    Thyme is a plant that was exported to California, from NZ a decade ago, for planting beside highways as it smells nice, is good ground cover & hardy plant in a drought. I havnt heard much about it lately though.

  6. The Following User Says Thank You to eesakiwi for This Post:


  7. #5
    blackgold12 is offline Metal Recycling Entrepreneur
    blackgold12 started this thread.
    SMF Badges of Honor

    Member since
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    195
    Thanks
    54
    Thanked 121 Times in 79 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by t00nces2 View Post
    What kind of essential oils are you going to make and where are you going to source your supplies? Is there any worries about impurities in the sourced materials that may be concentrated in the resulting oil? I would think pesticides and herbicides and fertilizers or local contaminants could be concentrated in the resulting product. I don't mean to criticize, I am asking because I would think that distilling oils would be harder than distilling alcohol and the result would be much more concentrated and less likely to dilute any unwanted impurities.
    I will send a sample into the lab for analysis, we don't want any unwanted contaminants in the oil, that $35.00 laboratory fee is cheap insurance.

    Mother nature will provide the source material, in this province black spruce is the dominant species some blue spruce and cedar can also be found.

    Nearby there's a sawmill they log their own timber ( Black Spruce ) they leave the branches laying in the forest, I'm sure they'll let me harvest some of the waste.

    If it's possible to distill sawdust from the mill this would be my preferred option.

    As for herbicides and pesticides I would rather they be airborne than ground based, air born aerosols are broken down with heat and UV exposure. Any attached to the trees will soon be sanitized, just give it a week or so before harvesting your crop after spraying season is over.

    Natural sunlight is the largest source of UV the still provides heat from the steam generated, the certificate of analysis will tell ya if your product is within safe limits.

    Multiple still runs maybe added up to accumulate a larger batch, if you had neighbors participating in recovering oil you could add their production runs into the larger lot. From this lot the sample is sent in for analysis.

    One the sample has been removed and sent to the lab no more additions can be made to that lot.

    You can do a simple test to qualify your product

    Characterization of Essential Oils by Chromatography .... Paper and Thin Layer Chromatographic

    Isn't science a great adventure, short video demonstrating paper
    Chromatography

    <span class="st"><em>


  8. #6
    blackgold12 is offline Metal Recycling Entrepreneur
    blackgold12 started this thread.
    SMF Badges of Honor

    Member since
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    195
    Thanks
    54
    Thanked 121 Times in 79 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by eesakiwi View Post
    Safrole oil from the Sassafras tree roots is worth a lot of money ;->

    Seriously though, some guys in NZ decided to extract oil from wild pine trees ( a nuisance plant if they start growing in the wild.) It turned into a good money maker.

    Fennel & lavender also sell well. Anything thats sought after due to 'fashion' or a craze ( like lavender )
    or as a chemical feedstock ( fennel ) would make a nice $ return.

    Thyme is a plant that was exported to California, from NZ a decade ago, for planting beside highways as it smells nice, is good ground cover & hardy plant in a drought. I havnt heard much about it lately though.
    Interdasting, NOTICE - Safrole and Sassafras Oil are used in the Illicit Manufacture of MDMA

    https://www.deadiversion.usdoj.gov/c...es/safrole.htm

  9. #7
    blackgold12 is offline Metal Recycling Entrepreneur
    blackgold12 started this thread.
    SMF Badges of Honor

    Member since
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    195
    Thanks
    54
    Thanked 121 Times in 79 Posts
    Just about everything you need to know, interesting article.
    https://apothecarysgarden.com/2014/0...ce-sap-part-1/


  10. #8
    blackgold12 is offline Metal Recycling Entrepreneur
    blackgold12 started this thread.
    SMF Badges of Honor

    Member since
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    195
    Thanks
    54
    Thanked 121 Times in 79 Posts
    Went to the farm this afternoon, used the metal lathe to machine to tops off of the brass screw tops then drilled few holes into the bottom of the reflux column.

    Rob the owner showed up while I was working and we had an excellent chat, said they just purchased another parcel of land they'll soon be clearing off.

    They have a firewood processor that is pretty much automatic once the log is placed onto the machine, anyhow he said that I was free to harvest branches.

    Bottom coil has nothing to do with this project, just wanted to know if this stainless steel tubing could be made into a coil with out kinking.






  11. #9
    blackgold12 is offline Metal Recycling Entrepreneur
    blackgold12 started this thread.
    SMF Badges of Honor

    Member since
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    195
    Thanks
    54
    Thanked 121 Times in 79 Posts
    Boiler and reflux column were dropped off at the Colony yesterday for modifications and to have the parts needed for the mod Tig welded were needed.

    Figured the Tog welds would look so much nicer and a bit less expensive than had I used silver solder.

    Modifications requested, enlarge the opening on the boiler, cut two stainless rings one to be welded onto the enlarged opening the other to the bottom of the reflux. Bottom ring will have a circle of holes drilled and threaded to secure the reflux. Easy disassembly for loading the boiler.

    The other modification is to install a 10"x12" clean out, a rectangle cut from stainless tig welded near the bottom of the boiler with a heavy sheet formed to fit and bolted into place. Once removed making it easy to rake out spent material from the bottom rather than trying to reach in from the top to clean out the boiler.

    The Colony laser is currently booked for the next month. my job is in the queue so don't expect any further reporting on this build anytime soon.

  12. #10
    blackgold12 is offline Metal Recycling Entrepreneur
    blackgold12 started this thread.
    SMF Badges of Honor

    Member since
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    195
    Thanks
    54
    Thanked 121 Times in 79 Posts
    This guy just produced 200 milliliters of oil, love his still set up and it appears to be all home made.

    OK, 200 mil of oil don't sound like much but when you do the math, 5 mil of fir oil sells for $12.99 that 200 mil gave him 40 bottles when sold gives him a whopping return of $519.00

    With my 30 gallon still I'm anticipating 50 mil of oil per run ( $129.00 ) if and when I find it profitable can expand the size of my still and use the refux on a new still.

    No more scraping for me just sit back and drink beer while keeping an eye on the still as it produces money for more beer.


  13. The Following User Says Thank You to blackgold12 for This Post:


  14. #11
    blackgold12 is offline Metal Recycling Entrepreneur
    blackgold12 started this thread.
    SMF Badges of Honor

    Member since
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    195
    Thanks
    54
    Thanked 121 Times in 79 Posts
    Just got off the phone with the manager of a native sawmill and oil producer, very informative conversation in addition sending me some literature and pictures of the operation..

  15. #12
    blackgold12 is offline Metal Recycling Entrepreneur
    blackgold12 started this thread.
    SMF Badges of Honor

    Member since
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    195
    Thanks
    54
    Thanked 121 Times in 79 Posts
    Colony just sent the job quote, $1000.00 but will supply material and laser cut the parts needed for $250.00 . Looks like I'll be buying my second Tig.

    My first Tig was a square wave high frequency unit that I had paid in the neighborhood of $3500.00 for, these new Chinese Tig units cost a third and have more features.

    He said they''ll try and have the parts cut over the weekend.

    Also gathering parts for a much larger still.

  16. #13
    eesakiwi's Avatar
    SMF Badges of Honor



    Member since
    Dec 2010
    Location
    NZ
    Posts
    2,367
    Thanks
    2,414
    Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,127 Posts
    Yep, i knew about the safroles roles.. I hear that sassafrass is pretty common on the upper west coast & i still dont know what it smells like. If its Liquorice, or a clinging citrus smell, or like Bandaids used to smell like.

    Thanks for the chromotography video. Thats one of the things that got me into science when i was 8, seeing the setup thru the school windows. I knew instantly what they were doing & its uses. The other thing was making 'black powder'..

    Would having the whole Still setup running under a vacuum speed up the process?
    Its standard practise in a Laboratory but i have never heard it mentioned when it comes to distilling alcohol.

    I made a water condensor out of a long Stainless steel tube.
    I found two Tee shaped pipe fittings with external threads on each end, and internal on the side fitting. They are the sort that you use to join Copper pipe, you slide the fittings nut onto the Copper tube, then slip on a Brass ring, then push the end of the pipe into the fitting, then screw the nut over the Brass ring & thread it onto the fitting.
    The nut crushes the Brass ring a bit, grabbing it and sealing on it, while the ring crushes onto the pipe & locks into place.

    The Tee fittings were big enough to slide right over the Stainless steel tubing. One for each end of the tubing.
    I put a rubber washer on the tube in place of the Brass ring, then put the nut on tight.
    I measured the distance in between the Tees and cut a length of clear hose a bit longer than that.
    Then removed one Tee fitting off the tube.
    The inner dia of the hose was the right size to fit over the unused yet, threaded part of the Tee fitting, then hose clamped it in place.
    I slid the other Tee fitting back on & hose clamped the hose in place again.
    Then screwed in two hose fittings into the side part of the Tee fitting.
    A ( Near ) instant condensor made of 12 parts directly off the shelf.
    Last edited by eesakiwi; 08-07-2019 at 03:15 PM.

  17. The Following User Says Thank You to eesakiwi for This Post:


  18. #14
    DiamondN's Avatar
    SMF Badges of Honor


    Member since
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Indiana
    Posts
    846
    Thanks
    1,725
    Thanked 353 Times in 226 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by blackgold12 View Post
    Just sit back and drink beer while keeping an eye on the still as it produces money for more beer.

    I like your thinking...

  19. The Following User Says Thank You to DiamondN for This Post:


  20. #15
    blackgold12 is offline Metal Recycling Entrepreneur
    blackgold12 started this thread.
    SMF Badges of Honor

    Member since
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    195
    Thanks
    54
    Thanked 121 Times in 79 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by eesakiwi View Post
    Yep, i knew about the safroles roles.. I hear that sassafrass is pretty common on the upper west coast & i still dont know what it smells like. If its Liquorice, or a clinging citrus smell, or like Bandaids used to smell like.

    Thanks for the chromotography video. Thats one of the things that got me into science when i was 8, seeing the setup thru the school windows. I knew instantly what they were doing & its uses. The other thing was making 'black powder'..

    Would having the whole Still setup running under a vacuum speed up the process?
    Its standard practise in a Laboratory but i have never heard it mentioned when it comes to distilling alcohol.

    I made a water condensor out of a long Stainless steel tube.
    I found two Tee shaped pipe fittings with external threads on each end, and internal on the side fitting. They are the sort that you use to join Copper pipe, you slide the fittings nut onto the Copper tube, then slip on a Brass ring, then push the end of the pipe into the fitting, then screw the nut over the Brass ring & thread it onto the fitting.
    The nut crushes the Brass ring a bit, grabbing it and sealing on it, while the ring crushes onto the pipe & locks into place.

    The Tee fittings were big enough to slide right over the Stainless steel tubing. One for each end of the tubing.
    I put a rubber washer on the tube in place of the Brass ring, then put the nut on tight.
    I measured the distance in between the Tees and cut a length of clear hose a bit longer than that.
    Then removed one Tee fitting off the tube.
    The inner dia of the hose was the right size to fit over the unused yet, threaded part of the Tee fitting, then hose clamped it in place.
    I slid the other Tee fitting back on & hose clamped the hose in place again.
    Then screwed in two hose fittings into the side part of the Tee fitting.
    A ( Near ) instant condensor made of 12 parts directly off the shelf.

    Vacuum distilling would work but you would need one big MF of a pump.

    As it is I'm trying something new by using the refux column there maybe no added benefit just wasted money. I don't care to add to that expenditure by trying a vacuum set up when we already know that steam is the traditional method used to distill the oils that I'm after.

    Vacuum pumps are expensive and costly to maintain and to make matters worse you would need an oil-less pump like those used to fill divers tanks.

    There are other method's used for instance to recover hemp oil solvents are used and to extract canola they uses a screw press.

  21. #16
    blackgold12 is offline Metal Recycling Entrepreneur
    blackgold12 started this thread.
    SMF Badges of Honor

    Member since
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    195
    Thanks
    54
    Thanked 121 Times in 79 Posts
    Have you ever connected a vacuum line to the intake manifold of your car or truck then connect that hose to a 45 gallon metal drum, after a few minutes with the engine idling the drum will collapse in the middle then soon the ends pull towards the center..

    Has to be a gasoline engine as diesels do not create manifold vacuum.

  22. #17
    numbers's Avatar
    SMF Badges of Honor

    Member since
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    165
    Thanks
    1,277
    Thanked 282 Times in 107 Posts
    Thanks for sharing what you are working on. This is very intriguing!

  23. The Following 2 Users say Thank You for This Post by numbers:


  24. #18
    blackgold12 is offline Metal Recycling Entrepreneur
    blackgold12 started this thread.
    SMF Badges of Honor

    Member since
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    195
    Thanks
    54
    Thanked 121 Times in 79 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by numbers View Post
    Thanks for sharing what you are working on. This is very intriguing!
    As long as there's an interest I'll keep posting.

    Food grade silicon tubing can withstand heat upwards 500 degrees.

    Preparing stainless steel for silver soldering use stainless steel wire brush

    Stainless steel drum from dryer would make an excellent basket, just need to drill more holes on the bottom to pass steam

    Older Speed Queen washing machines used stainless steel drum, a pair welded together would make a nice sized still.

    Thermostat from electric hot water tank strapped to your still would control the heat.

    An old stove pipe with a 90 degree elbow will direct propane heat onto the bottom of the vessel, this is how we would warm up a diesel engine for starting during one of our cold Canadian winters.

    Early humans have employed essential oils in their daily lives long before stainless steel or copper sheet came into existence.

    For those who wish to learn more there's plenty of books on the subject at open library.

    Essential oils, https://openlibrary.org/search?q=essential+oils&m=edit&mode=ebooks&has_ful ltext=true

    Volatile oils, https://openlibrary.org/search?q=Vol..._fulltext=true
    Last edited by blackgold12; 08-07-2019 at 07:35 PM.

  25. The Following 2 Users say Thank You for This Post by blackgold12:


  26. #19
    blackgold12 is offline Metal Recycling Entrepreneur
    blackgold12 started this thread.
    SMF Badges of Honor

    Member since
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    195
    Thanks
    54
    Thanked 121 Times in 79 Posts
    From this document learned that wood chips and sawdust from mill waste will also produce oil.

    The oil from branches of the Thuja genus of trees, otherwise known as cedar leaf oil, has been distilled in the eastern United States and eastern Canada for over a hundred years (Thomas and Schumann, 1993). Oil is also distilled from the wood of the Thuja genus of trees.

    https://open.library.ubc.ca/cIRcle/collections/undergraduateresearch/52966/items/1.0107429



  27. #20
    blackgold12 is offline Metal Recycling Entrepreneur
    blackgold12 started this thread.
    SMF Badges of Honor

    Member since
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    195
    Thanks
    54
    Thanked 121 Times in 79 Posts
    Material

    Cedar boughs are needed for the production of leaf oil and cedar heartwood is needed for the production of wood oil. On average, one tonne of cedar boughs produces between 12 and 16 pounds of oil. One tonne of boughs is roughly equivalent to three heaping truckloads.

    The heartwood used for oil production is usually in the form of sawdust from the waste produced by furniture factories and lumber mills

  28. The Following User Says Thank You to blackgold12 for This Post:



  29. Similar threads on the Scrap Metal Forum

    1. Value of a Red Iron Building
      By 157buck in forum Scrap Metal Prices
      Replies: 6
      Last Post: 08-24-2019, 08:01 PM
    2. This thread has a tip for you - Building a business.
      By EcoSafe in forum A Day in the Life of a Scrapper
      Replies: 7
      Last Post: 05-31-2015, 08:11 PM
    3. Well its official- Just rented a building
      By ResourcefulRecycling in forum General - Let's talk business
      Replies: 2
      Last Post: 08-17-2012, 11:22 AM
    4. New building!
      By easyrecycle in forum General - Let's talk business
      Replies: 11
      Last Post: 06-01-2012, 04:02 PM
    5. Building a portfolio
      By easyrecycle in forum Off Topic Discussions
      Replies: 13
      Last Post: 12-20-2011, 10:44 PM

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

 
Browse the Most Recent Threads
On SMF In THIS CATEGORY.





OR

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

The Scrap Metal Forum

    The Scrap Metal Forum is the #1 scrap metal recycling community in the world. Here we talk about the scrap metal business, making money, where we connect with other scrappers, scrap yards and more.

SMF on Facebook and Twitter

Twitter Facebook